assateague wrote:Sometimes the quickest way to put out a fire is with an explosion.
assateague wrote:Here's the way I see it:
I have to ask permission to protect myself. In many places, the answer is "no, you may not protect yourself". It really does boil down to something that simple. And that's fucked up.
Why may I not protect myself? Because "maybe something bad will happen". Well, again, that's bullshit. Many, many people are being told "no, you may NOT protect yourself", based purely on some hypothetical, possible "damage". But yet this "hypothetical" is generally based on the actions of those idiots who commit crimes, and we all must pay the price, in being made more of a victim than we should be. Because of the actions of others, I may not protect myself or my family. I know you're not much into the Bible, but this really sums it up nicely:
Proverbs 18:5
"It is not good to show partiality to the guilty by perverting the justice due the innocent. "
Bootlipkiller wrote: all the mallards I killed today had boners do to my epic calling.
Bootlipkiller wrote: all the mallards I killed today had boners do to my epic calling.
Goldfish wrote:That does happen to me. Constantly. However, I don't think these girls have seen 110lbs in a long time...
Bootlipkiller wrote: all the mallards I killed today had boners do to my epic calling.
assateague wrote:It's one thing for us to talk about it, but imagine this. And really, seriously think about it:
A 110 pound woman, who gets leered at every time she goes somewhere. Stared at while pumping gas, looked at in the grocery store parking lot, and so on. Many places have, in effect, told her "sorry about your luck. Hope you don't get raped".
I can defend myself, at least for a while. But she is completely defenseless, and CANNOT have a weapon to defend herself. Just take a minute to imagine what that feels like. To be 100% at the mercy of society, and hopefully not be at the wrong place at the wrong time, or else she's dead.
Because some bureaucrat or politician won't let her have a gun, so she could keep herself from being dead. That's just wrong.
Glimmerjim wrote:assateague wrote:It's one thing for us to talk about it, but imagine this. And really, seriously think about it:
A 110 pound woman, who gets leered at every time she goes somewhere. Stared at while pumping gas, looked at in the grocery store parking lot, and so on. Many places have, in effect, told her "sorry about your luck. Hope you don't get raped".
I can defend myself, at least for a while. But she is completely defenseless, and CANNOT have a weapon to defend herself. Just take a minute to imagine what that feels like. To be 100% at the mercy of society, and hopefully not be at the wrong place at the wrong time, or else she's dead.
Because some bureaucrat or politician won't let her have a gun, so she could keep herself from being dead. That's just wrong.
I think that's a very valid point, at, that I've never really thought about. Several questions, though. Do you think an attractive woman has a higher chance of being raped than an unattractive one? Sounds ridiculous, but you hear a lot about 89 year old women raped, and you also hear that rape is not a sexual urge but a control issue. I realize that through our eyes the answer is obvious, but we're not rapists.
Secondly, what do you think of stun guns, pepper spray, and very loud hand held horns? I honestly have no idea of how effective they would be, but they would reduce the chances of collateral damage to innocent bystanders. That is really my only concern in this. Were it not for fear of my child, wife, or someone's grandmother getting hit by a stray bullet I would chip in to provide everyone with a decent handgun. Or design a bullet/shotshell similar to a "flu-flu" arrow that has an effective range of 10 feet, say? I'm not sure how to do it, but I am sure someone could figure it out. Energy dissipated, or materials fragments within a certain distance?
Eric Haynes wrote:Glimmerjim wrote:assateague wrote:It's one thing for us to talk about it, but imagine this. And really, seriously think about it:
A 110 pound woman, who gets leered at every time she goes somewhere. Stared at while pumping gas, looked at in the grocery store parking lot, and so on. Many places have, in effect, told her "sorry about your luck. Hope you don't get raped".
I can defend myself, at least for a while. But she is completely defenseless, and CANNOT have a weapon to defend herself. Just take a minute to imagine what that feels like. To be 100% at the mercy of society, and hopefully not be at the wrong place at the wrong time, or else she's dead.
Because some bureaucrat or politician won't let her have a gun, so she could keep herself from being dead. That's just wrong.
I think that's a very valid point, at, that I've never really thought about. Several questions, though. Do you think an attractive woman has a higher chance of being raped than an unattractive one? Sounds ridiculous, but you hear a lot about 89 year old women raped, and you also hear that rape is not a sexual urge but a control issue. I realize that through our eyes the answer is obvious, but we're not rapists.
Secondly, what do you think of stun guns, pepper spray, and very loud hand held horns? I honestly have no idea of how effective they would be, but they would reduce the chances of collateral damage to innocent bystanders. That is really my only concern in this. Were it not for fear of my child, wife, or someone's grandmother getting hit by a stray bullet I would chip in to provide everyone with a decent handgun. Or design a bullet/shotshell similar to a "flu-flu" arrow that has an effective range of 10 feet, say? I'm not sure how to do it, but I am sure someone could figure it out. Energy dissipated, or materials fragments within a certain distance?
I'd rather my loved one get hit by a bullet that stopped a rape than for a rape to occur simply because one worried too much about "innocent bystanders"
Glimmerjim wrote:assateague wrote:It's one thing for us to talk about it, but imagine this. And really, seriously think about it:
A 110 pound woman, who gets leered at every time she goes somewhere. Stared at while pumping gas, looked at in the grocery store parking lot, and so on. Many places have, in effect, told her "sorry about your luck. Hope you don't get raped".
I can defend myself, at least for a while. But she is completely defenseless, and CANNOT have a weapon to defend herself. Just take a minute to imagine what that feels like. To be 100% at the mercy of society, and hopefully not be at the wrong place at the wrong time, or else she's dead.
Because some bureaucrat or politician won't let her have a gun, so she could keep herself from being dead. That's just wrong.
I think that's a very valid point, at, that I've never really thought about. Several questions, though. Do you think an attractive woman has a higher chance of being raped than an unattractive one? Sounds ridiculous, but you hear a lot about 89 year old women raped, and you also hear that rape is not a sexual urge but a control issue. I realize that through our eyes the answer is obvious, but we're not rapists.
Secondly, what do you think of stun guns, pepper spray, and very loud hand held horns? I honestly have no idea of how effective they would be, but they would reduce the chances of collateral damage to innocent bystanders. That is really my only concern in this. Were it not for fear of my child, wife, or someone's grandmother getting hit by a stray bullet I would chip in to provide everyone with a decent handgun. Or design a bullet/shotshell similar to a "flu-flu" arrow that has an effective range of 10 feet, say? I'm not sure how to do it, but I am sure someone could figure it out. Energy dissipated, or materials fragments within a certain distance?
Bad17 wrote:Guys life is life. You have to protect yourself and your family at all costs. I would hate for someone else to get hit with a stray round but that is why I practice. Am I an expert. With the thousands upon thousands of rounds I have put down range and all the military training I have had NO. But I feel that everyone should be able to carry a gun that wants one. You would see a change in the way criminals acted. I don't think Eric wants to see his child die at all and for you to even imply that's want he means makes me feel you are a dumbass. I think Eric is saying he wants that lady to kill the SOB that is trying to rape her and that he would not blame that lady if his child was shot. Would he be sad I would say yes what father would not be devastated. I would like to see an America that people had the right to protect themselves and if they were to shoot someone trying to do something horrible to them then so be it. People would quit if people will stand up for themselves. If someone was trying to harm me or my family I will use deadly force and I will sleep good at night knowing I did what I did to protect mine.
Eric Haynes wrote:Bad17 wrote:Guys life is life. You have to protect yourself and your family at all costs. I would hate for someone else to get hit with a stray round but that is why I practice. Am I an expert. With the thousands upon thousands of rounds I have put down range and all the military training I have had NO. But I feel that everyone should be able to carry a gun that wants one. You would see a change in the way criminals acted. I don't think Eric wants to see his child die at all and for you to even imply that's want he means makes me feel you are a dumbass. I think Eric is saying he wants that lady to kill the SOB that is trying to rape her and that he would not blame that lady if his child was shot. Would he be sad I would say yes what father would not be devastated. I would like to see an America that people had the right to protect themselves and if they were to shoot someone trying to do something horrible to them then so be it. People would quit if people will stand up for themselves. If someone was trying to harm me or my family I will use deadly force and I will sleep good at night knowing I did what I did to protect mine.
Exactly.
Bad17 wrote:Guys life is life. You have to protect yourself and your family at all costs. I would hate for someone else to get hit with a stray round but that is why I practice. Am I an expert. With the thousands upon thousands of rounds I have put down range and all the military training I have had NO. But I feel that everyone should be able to carry a gun that wants one. You would see a change in the way criminals acted. I don't think Eric wants to see his child die at all and for you to even imply that's want he means makes me feel you are a dumbass. I think Eric is saying he wants that lady to kill the SOB that is trying to rape her and that he would not blame that lady if his child was shot. Would he be sad I would say yes what father would not be devastated. I would like to see an America that people had the right to protect themselves and if they were to shoot someone trying to do something horrible to them then so be it. People would quit if people will stand up for themselves. If someone was trying to harm me or my family I will use deadly force and I will sleep good at night knowing I did what I did to protect mine.
Bad17 wrote:Well high school was long ago for me. Also to your rhetorical question sure wasn't read as that and it think others may have felt the same way. I guess I would not have even thought to have made a rhetorical question like that. To me as a father that is not a rhetorical question to ask and to your like experiences remark I have had many life experiences if you would like to chat about them feel free to pm me and I can list my military record for you with all my combat experience and I will have adult conversations with adults maybe you should review your statement and think about your rhetorical question.
DeadEye_Dan wrote:But, I'd be willing to bet that not one single rape/murder/kidnap victim had those thoughts while they were being assaulted. I'd also bet most (if not all) wished they'd had a gun while they were being attacked.
DeadEye_Dan wrote:GJ - I can appreciate and respect your view on the subject. You've clearly spent some time considering the situation.
But, I'd be willing to bet that not one single rape/murder/kidnap victim had those thoughts while they were being assaulted. I'd also bet most (if not all) wished they'd had a gun while they were being attacked.
Talking about hypotheticals and "what if" extenuating circumstances is great stuff for a forum, but when the shtf all that shit goes out the window when survival is on the line.
Glimmerjim wrote:DeadEye_Dan wrote:GJ - I can appreciate and respect your view on the subject. You've clearly spent some time considering the situation.
But, I'd be willing to bet that not one single rape/murder/kidnap victim had those thoughts while they were being assaulted. I'd also bet most (if not all) wished they'd had a gun while they were being attacked.
Talking about hypotheticals and "what if" extenuating circumstances is great stuff for a forum, but when the shtf all that shit goes out the window when survival is on the line.
That's very true, Dan, and that's the main reason it scares me. Trained cops fire 18 shots and don't hit their targets. Mom, who's been to the range 3 times, instantly under a huge amount of stress, and I'm afraid I can just see carnage of innocents.
Perhaps I'm just looking at it wrong. Under the right conditions I'm all for her unloading in an attacker, but when the armed teacher concept came up I thought about the several people I know that are teachers. One of which is my sister. Putting a gun in her hands with a room full of kids is a recipe for disaster. But I agree 100% that in the hands of someone responsible and confident it is the best answer.
Glimmerjim wrote:DeadEye_Dan wrote:GJ - I can appreciate and respect your view on the subject. You've clearly spent some time considering the situation.
But, I'd be willing to bet that not one single rape/murder/kidnap victim had those thoughts while they were being assaulted. I'd also bet most (if not all) wished they'd had a gun while they were being attacked.
Talking about hypotheticals and "what if" extenuating circumstances is great stuff for a forum, but when the shtf all that shit goes out the window when survival is on the line.
That's very true, Dan, and that's the main reason it scares me. Trained cops fire 18 shots and don't hit their targets. Mom, who's been to the range 3 times, instantly under a huge amount of stress, and I'm afraid I can just see carnage of innocents.
Perhaps I'm just looking at it wrong. Under the right conditions I'm all for her unloading in an attacker, but when the armed teacher concept came up I thought about the several people I know that are teachers. One of which is my sister. Putting a gun in her hands with a room full of kids is a recipe for disaster. But I agree 100% that in the hands of someone responsible and confident it is the best answer.
Glimmerjim wrote:DeadEye_Dan wrote:GJ - I can appreciate and respect your view on the subject. You've clearly spent some time considering the situation.
But, I'd be willing to bet that not one single rape/murder/kidnap victim had those thoughts while they were being assaulted. I'd also bet most (if not all) wished they'd had a gun while they were being attacked.
Talking about hypotheticals and "what if" extenuating circumstances is great stuff for a forum, but when the shtf all that shit goes out the window when survival is on the line.
That's very true, Dan, and that's the main reason it scares me. Trained cops fire 18 shots and don't hit their targets. Mom, who's been to the range 3 times, instantly under a huge amount of stress, and I'm afraid I can just see carnage of innocents.
Perhaps I'm just looking at it wrong. Under the right conditions I'm all for her unloading in an attacker, but when the armed teacher concept came up I thought about the several people I know that are teachers. One of which is my sister. Putting a gun in her hands with a room full of kids is a recipe for disaster. But I agree 100% that in the hands of someone responsible and confident it is the best answer.
Bootlipkiller wrote: all the mallards I killed today had boners do to my epic calling.
3legged_lab wrote:You guys are right, we should just give all women a whistle and wish them the best of luck.
clampdaddy wrote:3legged_lab wrote:You guys are right, we should just give all women a whistle and wish them the best of luck.
Wouldn't have to if they'd stay in the house like they're supposed to.
Bootlipkiller wrote: all the mallards I killed today had boners do to my epic calling.
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