Olly wrote: We're still the bastard pirates of the duck forum world.
Rick wrote:If they allow lead for waterfowl again, there will be a hell of a scramble for new excuses. (And having been around for the lead poisoning days, I think it a very bad idea.)
Rick wrote:If they allow lead for waterfowl again, there will be a hell of a scramble for new excuses. (And having been around for the lead poisoning days, I think it a very bad idea.)
Olly wrote: We're still the bastard pirates of the duck forum world.
SpinnerMan wrote:Rick wrote:If they allow lead for waterfowl again, there will be a hell of a scramble for new excuses. (And having been around for the lead poisoning days, I think it a very bad idea.)
That's not done by the EPA. I don't know, but I'm sure that is not what they are talking about.
As is, Obama could effectively issue an executive order banning lead in rifle ammo, turkey loads, etc. Of course, he would do it via the bureaucrats promulgating regulations in the name of the environment or some other excuse to advance his agenda.
This is the problem when you have people in power that are tasked with faithfully executing the law as intended, but they have no respect for the law. They do not see the law as constraining their behavior, and but as a tool to be used to push for the social change that they desire. The law constrains the lower classes of people like you and me and not those like Obama that need to control us for our own good.
They don't ask, what is the law, what was intended, how do we enforce that effectively given the limited resources we have?
They ask, what do we want, what can we do to make that happen, how far can we go today, how do we make sure we can go further tomorrow?
These people cannot be trusted because you never know when out of nowhere they will make a power grab. Look at the massive power grab when it comes to the internet. Obamacare, they couldn't even risk wasting time to read the thing, let alone actually proof read it, debate it, etc. Grab the power and let the bureaucrats do whatever they want and if they don't like it, they simply ignore the law, issue waiver to the law, etc. Obama is not even enforcing Obamacare because it doesn't serve his agenda.
Would they ban lead or do something like this?
Who the hell knows? You are all Chicagoans now It's a crazy upside down world.
DeadEye_Dan wrote:SpinnerMan wrote:Rick wrote:If they allow lead for waterfowl again, there will be a hell of a scramble for new excuses. (And having been around for the lead poisoning days, I think it a very bad idea.)
That's not done by the EPA. I don't know, but I'm sure that is not what they are talking about.
As is, Obama could effectively issue an executive order banning lead in rifle ammo, turkey loads, etc. Of course, he would do it via the bureaucrats promulgating regulations in the name of the environment or some other excuse to advance his agenda.
This is the problem when you have people in power that are tasked with faithfully executing the law as intended, but they have no respect for the law. They do not see the law as constraining their behavior, and but as a tool to be used to push for the social change that they desire. The law constrains the lower classes of people like you and me and not those like Obama that need to control us for our own good.
They don't ask, what is the law, what was intended, how do we enforce that effectively given the limited resources we have?
They ask, what do we want, what can we do to make that happen, how far can we go today, how do we make sure we can go further tomorrow?
These people cannot be trusted because you never know when out of nowhere they will make a power grab. Look at the massive power grab when it comes to the internet. Obamacare, they couldn't even risk wasting time to read the thing, let alone actually proof read it, debate it, etc. Grab the power and let the bureaucrats do whatever they want and if they don't like it, they simply ignore the law, issue waiver to the law, etc. Obama is not even enforcing Obamacare because it doesn't serve his agenda.
Would they ban lead or do something like this?
Who the hell knows? You are all Chicagoans now It's a crazy upside down world.
Nailed it
Rick wrote:If they allow lead for waterfowl again, there will be a hell of a scramble for new excuses. (And having been around for the lead poisoning days, I think it a very bad idea.)
Woody wrote:Rick wrote:If they allow lead for waterfowl again, there will be a hell of a scramble for new excuses. (And having been around for the lead poisoning days, I think it a very bad idea.)
I was not alive for it, but I've read studies that suggest it only effected a very very very small portion of the population. And even that population was only effected because of large hunting clubs like Byers.
As an approximation, however, and until better data are available, we can calculate the estimated mortality from lead poisoning of an assumed population of 50,000 male mallards on a given wintering or migration area in the following manner:
50,000 male mallards × 6.80 percent that have one or more lead pellets in their gizzards (Bellrose 1959) = 3,400 × 58.5 percent = 1,989 male mallards that will die of lead poisoning on the area.
Rick wrote:Woody wrote:Rick wrote:If they allow lead for waterfowl again, there will be a hell of a scramble for new excuses. (And having been around for the lead poisoning days, I think it a very bad idea.)
I was not alive for it, but I've read studies that suggest it only effected a very very very small portion of the population. And even that population was only effected because of large hunting clubs like Byers.
Your idea of "very, very, very small" may differ with others. Here's an educated guess based on available studies as calculated by Sanderson and Bellrose in A Review of the Problem of Lead Poisoning in Waterfowl (http://www.npwrc.usgs.gov/resource/birds/pbpoison/):As an approximation, however, and until better data are available, we can calculate the estimated mortality from lead poisoning of an assumed population of 50,000 male mallards on a given wintering or migration area in the following manner:
50,000 male mallards × 6.80 percent that have one or more lead pellets in their gizzards (Bellrose 1959) = 3,400 × 58.5 percent = 1,989 male mallards that will die of lead poisoning on the area.
And I'd not leave popular public hunting areas out of the greatest source mix. When they studied dead and dying birds found on Catahoula Lake, lead poisoning was the culprit in something like five to seven times as many cases as being crippled or unrecovered by hunters.
Rick wrote:What's stuck with me was that the hunters were asked to call their shots, and no one hit the bird they were shooting at.
Goldfish wrote:Good lord, what day of it today boys?
Shesh
Olly wrote:Wait. Lead shot is illegal?
Olly wrote: We're still the bastard pirates of the duck forum world.
Rick wrote:Goldfish wrote:Good lord, what day of it today boys?
Shesh
The day after this thread was started.
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