Concealed carry.

[Goldfish]

Don't recall a place in Minnetonka, but Bills Gun Shop up in Forest Lake(?), somewhere up north, is the one I'm thinking of. Some of the guys on the motorcycle forum go up there every so often.

Any suggestions on caliber? Is 9mm pointless? I think I heard it's the cheapest to shoot, and if you place your shot well enough I supposed a .22 will do the trick. I'd have to imagine getting shot with anything is going to deter someone regardless of caliber, but if you've got some bath salt induced zombie wanna by after you, is anything going to take them down?

[assateague]

I've never been much on the 9mm vs .45 vs .40 debate. Get whatever you want and learn to shoot it. Like you said, you hit what you're aiming at, they're going to stop. Most seem to think life is like Modern Warfare or some crap. My next is going to be the Taurus PT22 which is .22LR. Real comfortable, and fun as hell (and cheap) to shoot. I promise, it'll kill something. I've killed more than a few deer with a .22 LR. Allegedly.

[Westie25]

Any bullet is moving fast enough to kill. I believe the .22 kills more people annually that any other round. Find a gun that's comfortable in your hand and learn how to use it efficiently.

[Goldfish]

Would you shoot them in the alleged noggin or would an alleged heart shot from a .22 do it?


Basically, what would be best is to just go start holding guns to see what fits me it sounds like?

[assateague]

I'd say yes. If it's not comfortable, you're not going to shoot it as much as you should, if at all. And I have no intention of ever shooting at someone with a pistol if they're more than about arm's length away from me. Otherwise, I'll just run away. Yes, I'm serious about that. So from that distance, I'm going for the guts and then the head. If I'm getting sued, it's going to be by the guy's next of kin, not him. I'm getting my money's worth.

Whatever you decide on will work fine. What you DON'T want to do is buy into the crap that will more than likely be being talked by the guys at the gun shop. Set your pride aside, go in and just "play" with guns. Admitting you don't know much usually gets you better info anyway. BUt if you're comfortable with a gun, don't be talked out of it by some silly ass ballistics argument from a guy sitting behind the counter. If he bad mouths you're choice in any way, ask him if you can load it and shoot him with the .22 to see what happens.

[Goldfish]

I was talking about the deer with the noggin or heart shot.

Allegedly.

[assateague]

Oh. Yes, noggin. Just in front of the ear. Allegedly.

[Goldfish]

If it's good enough for the mob, should be good enough for Bambi.

I picked up a crowd cut to go do the Gander Acedemy thing at Gander Mtn. You test out their vitrual range and then at the end use a... glock(?) on their live range.

[The Mad Duck]

Ruger LC9 IWB holster

[ManlyMan]

Assa, I imagine you have a world wind more experience in hunting the most dangerous game and combat, but after my trauma rotation I decided I wanted the biggest baddest caliber possible.

I'm not military trained and certainly have never been in a life or death situation with a firearm so couldn't even begin to think I could as calmly and accurately aim at anything as someone who is. That's why I want a .45 or 10mm. Those people who come into the trauma bay, it is amazing what the human body can endure. Especially when hopped up on pcp or bath salts. I saw a guy come in 3 rounds in the chest still having to be restrained. Anyway. That's my very limited experience and my input. Crazy people are just that, crazy and if I'm only good enough to put a center mass gut shot I want as big as possible because crazy people have super human strength.

Not disagreeing with carrying something you have to conceal. Just relating what I experienced over that short month and what I walked away with as an unscientific observation.

TL;DR saw lots of 9mm people walk into an ED. Never saw a .45.

[Olly]

Assa, I imagine you have a world wind more experience in hunting the most dangerous game and combat, but after my trauma rotation I decided I wanted the biggest baddest caliber possible.

I'm not military trained and certainly have never been in a life or death situation with a firearm so couldn't even begin to think I could as calmly and accurately aim at anything as someone who is. That's why I want a .45 or 10mm. Those people who come into the trauma bay, it is amazing what the human body can endure. Especially when hopped up on pcp or bath salts. I saw a guy come in 3 rounds in the chest still having to be restrained. Anyway. That's my very limited experience and my input. Crazy people are just that, crazy and if I'm only good enough to put a center mass gut shot I want as big as possible because crazy people have super human strength.

Not disagreeing with carrying something you have to conceal. Just relating what I experienced over that short month and what I walked away with as an unscientific observation.

TL;DR saw lots of 9mm people walk into an ED. Never saw a .45.

A 9mm JHP is going to cause more damage than a FMJ .45. Do you know the kind of bullet the people that walked in were shot with?

I am a lot more accurate with a 9mm than a .45... most people are and if it's life or death I want to hit my target instead of scaring him with a louder bang.

[Flightstopper]

But a .45 JHP will flip the gravity switch to yesterday (hope I got that right Assa ). .45 in a 1911 really isn't bad to shoot. Shoot mine way better than my glock. Of course this is my performance

[assateague]

I just made that up on the fly, too.

[assateague]

Assa, I imagine you have a world wind more experience in hunting the most dangerous game and combat, but after my trauma rotation I decided I wanted the biggest baddest caliber possible.

I'm not military trained and certainly have never been in a life or death situation with a firearm so couldn't even begin to think I could as calmly and accurately aim at anything as someone who is. That's why I want a .45 or 10mm. Those people who come into the trauma bay, it is amazing what the human body can endure. Especially when hopped up on pcp or bath salts. I saw a guy come in 3 rounds in the chest still having to be restrained. Anyway. That's my very limited experience and my input. Crazy people are just that, crazy and if I'm only good enough to put a center mass gut shot I want as big as possible because crazy people have super human strength.

Not disagreeing with carrying something you have to conceal. Just relating what I experienced over that short month and what I walked away with as an unscientific observation.

TL;DR saw lots of 9mm people walk into an ED. Never saw a .45.

Not arguing, doc. If I'm ever in some situation on the street, I'm running the other way as fast as I can if possible, maybe shooting over my shoulder, depending. Standing and shooting it out is for suckers or someone with no way out. I was referring more to the "around the house" type situation. And I'd be willing to bet you see even less 12 gauge #4 buck wounds than .45 wounds

But I stick by my assertion that a .22 in the hands of someone who has practiced so much it's second nature, and a natural extension of the hand, is better than having a .45 in each hand, if the person with the .45 shoots it only a couple times a year.

[ManlyMan]

Assa I totally agree about the experienced hand part.


Olly, I would assume most of these gun shots were all made with whatever was cheapest at Walmart by people without a friggin clue.

Now I'm not going to get into any sort of ballistics debate because frankly I don't know jack. All I was giving was my unscientific observation after one month in the trauma bay. I walked away and said no way in hell would I not want as big of a round as possible. Because truthfully I don't care how much I practiced when the shit hit the fan I wasn't going to be very good because that's a situation I'd never actually been in. Just like when I went to shoot a deer. I consider myself an excellent archer. That all went to hell with a deer standing 18 yds away. Didn't pull off the greatest of shots. Now if I were shooting a pistol I would have much rather had a .45 with a bad shot than a 9mm with a bad shot.

Again, not gonna try and talk ballistics. And some gun is certainly better than no gun, but like I said my unscientific observation over a month was that people high on drugs or crazy enough to try and kill me have superhuman strength and I want a .45. Just my personal preference.


All this coming from a guy who doesn't even carry a .45. I carry a .40, but will be making the switch as soon as financially feasible. Have a .45 now but it's full size so don't carry it unless I open carry.

Again not trying to start a ballistics debate. Simply stating that in my hands without any sort of combat experience, I made the decision I'd prefer a .45 for the reasons listed above.

[assateague]

I do agree. It all comes down to practice. As for the archery, here's a tip (you may feel ridiculous doing this, but it works). We used to do this at some pistol and rifle ranges in the Army. Do about 10 pushups as fast as you can. (all the way down) Get up, stand on an upside down 5-gallon bucket, draw, and shoot. Only allow yourself about 4 seconds from draw to shoot, counting in your head. Do this about 5 times in a row. After a couple weeks, you'll be able to get your body back in control very, very quickly, and the physical rush is the closest you'll come to the adrenalin rush. But it really does work. If you're shooting a gun, there's no need for the "standing on a bucket" bit. I just added that when I was adapting it for shooting from a treestand.

[ManlyMan]

Haha should I also do the bleat noise while standing on the bucket?

[assateague]

I was afraid of that reaction.

Seriously though, it works very, very well.

[Goldfish]

Haha should I also do the bleat noise while standing on the bucket?

Have the deer bleat to make you stop moving

[aunt betty]

Doc says .45 and I'm with him.
Can't hide my pistol and won't bother. Wear it on my hip in a holster where you can see it. Got a deal on a .357-magnum.
I wish I had my old .45.
That 1911 was designed for two things.
To kill a horse and to knock a charging soldier with a bayonet backwards onto his keester.
I vote for THAT.