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Looking at getting a muzzle loader. No experience with them. No idea what I'm getting into. Been looking at a CVA Optima V2. Seems like a reasonable mid level gun.

What don't I know and what do I need to know?

Tucker posted on here a while back and I asked him about his Savage that shoots smokeless powder. My buddy had been looking into them. When I get the money, I will own one.

I have a CVA. Works good, kills stuff. What more do you need?

ManlyMan wrote:Looking at getting a muzzle loader. No experience with them. No idea what I'm getting into. Been looking at a CVA Optima V2. Seems like a reasonable mid level gun.

What don't I know and what do I need to know?

I think if you get one with an easily removable breech plug and that doesn't need a tool to cap, you'll be fine regardless of brand. I had the cheap TC from Walmart (Omega Z1 or something, I think) and it was awesome. Very accurate out to about 240. I sold it when I went the primitive route and built my Kentucky rifle, but they're very good guns, and cheap.

But like I said- tool less cap, and easy to remove breech plug, and it doesn't matter.

Best thing about them is it extends your hunting season, just like archery.

thinking about getting one myself this year

AKPirate wrote:Best thing about them is it extends your hunting season, just like archery.

That's why I went with the Kentucky Rifle. The national park I hunt had an extra 3 weeks for primitive muzzleloaders only, in addition to the regular ML seasons. Of course they shitcanned that plan the year after I built the Kentucky rifle.

assateague wrote:

AKPirate wrote:Best thing about them is it extends your hunting season, just like archery.

That's why I went with the Kentucky Rifle. The national park I hunt had an extra 3 weeks for primitive muzzleloaders only, in addition to the regular ML seasons. Of course they shitcanned that plan the year after I built the Kentucky rifle.

what caliber did you build again? i was thinking of getting a .54 but according to what i've read you could be a little under-gunned out here with anything less than .60 cal.

.50. And I don't think that's undergunned. At 300 yards with 85 grains, the ball still has the energy of a .357 at point blank, or some shit like that.

Get one that breaks open to get at the breach plug. Not the bolt action type. My dad has the CVA Accura and it's a nice gun. Will put 1-2" groups at 150 yards with good bullet and powder.

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

assateague wrote:

AKPirate wrote:Best thing about them is it extends your hunting season, just like archery.

That's why I went with the Kentucky Rifle. The national park I hunt had an extra 3 weeks for primitive muzzleloaders only, in addition to the regular ML seasons. Of course they shitcanned that plan the year after I built the Kentucky rifle.

what caliber did you build again? i was thinking of getting a .54 but according to what i've read you could be a little under-gunned out here with anything less than .60 cal.

I guarantee you a .50 will drop ANYTHING in north america, dead as can be.

Eric Haynes wrote:

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

assateague wrote:

AKPirate wrote:Best thing about them is it extends your hunting season, just like archery.

That's why I went with the Kentucky Rifle. The national park I hunt had an extra 3 weeks for primitive muzzleloaders only, in addition to the regular ML seasons. Of course they shitcanned that plan the year after I built the Kentucky rifle.

what caliber did you build again? i was thinking of getting a .54 but according to what i've read you could be a little under-gunned out here with anything less than .60 cal.

I guarantee you a .50 will drop ANYTHING in north america, dead as can be.

Better than 7.5's?

Eric Haynes wrote:I guarantee you a .50 will drop ANYTHING in north america, dead as can be.

challenge accepted, you can fly out here and shoot a moose with your flintlock to prove me wrong.

Eric Haynes wrote:

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

assateague wrote:

AKPirate wrote:Best thing about them is it extends your hunting season, just like archery.

That's why I went with the Kentucky Rifle. The national park I hunt had an extra 3 weeks for primitive muzzleloaders only, in addition to the regular ML seasons. Of course they shitcanned that plan the year after I built the Kentucky rifle.

what caliber did you build again? i was thinking of getting a .54 but according to what i've read you could be a little under-gunned out here with anything less than .60 cal.

I guarantee you a .50 will drop ANYTHING in north america, dead as can be.

you know they are talking about shooting lead balls, right?

i do agree though. a .50 muzzle loader will kill all north american game.....................if you take headshots

Why use lead balls? We use copper plated hollow points with a wad. They destroy a deer... I can't see why they wouldn't take down an elk or moose.

NuffDaddy wrote:Why use lead balls? We use copper plated hollow points with a wad. They destroy a deer... I can't see why they wouldn't take down an elk or moose.

not sure but i think traditional muzzleloaders don't have barrels rated for copper plated slugs. maybe assa knows whether that's true or not.

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

NuffDaddy wrote:Why use lead balls? We use copper plated hollow points with a wad. They destroy a deer... I can't see why they wouldn't take down an elk or moose.

not sure but i think traditional muzzleloaders don't have barrels rated for copper plated slugs. maybe assa knows whether that's true or not.

When did we start talking about traditional muzzleloaders?

NuffDaddy wrote:

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

NuffDaddy wrote:Why use lead balls? We use copper plated hollow points with a wad. They destroy a deer... I can't see why they wouldn't take down an elk or moose.

not sure but i think traditional muzzleloaders don't have barrels rated for copper plated slugs. maybe assa knows whether that's true or not.

When did we start talking about traditional muzzleloaders?

so this thread is only for inlines?

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

NuffDaddy wrote:

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

NuffDaddy wrote:Why use lead balls? We use copper plated hollow points with a wad. They destroy a deer... I can't see why they wouldn't take down an elk or moose.

not sure but i think traditional muzzleloaders don't have barrels rated for copper plated slugs. maybe assa knows whether that's true or not.

When did we start talking about traditional muzzleloaders?

so this thread is only for inlines?

It's for muzzleloaders in general I think. I would guess that doc is looking for a modern gun though.

NuffDaddy wrote:

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

NuffDaddy wrote:

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

NuffDaddy wrote:Why use lead balls? We use copper plated hollow points with a wad. They destroy a deer... I can't see why they wouldn't take down an elk or moose.

not sure but i think traditional muzzleloaders don't have barrels rated for copper plated slugs. maybe assa knows whether that's true or not.

When did we start talking about traditional muzzleloaders?

so this thread is only for inlines?

It's for muzzleloaders in general I think. I would guess that doc is looking for a modern gun though.

just looked up the muzzleloader regs for MT, turns out you can't use anything other than roundball and it must have an exposed ignition device (flintlock, matchlock, wheelock, or percussion cap).

i assume modern inlines would fall into the regular rifle category and could still be used, but wouldn't be considered muzzleloaders by MT law. best to check your state regs.

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

NuffDaddy wrote:

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

NuffDaddy wrote:

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:[quote="NuffDaddy"]Why use lead balls? We use copper plated hollow points with a wad. They destroy a deer... I can't see why they wouldn't take down an elk or moose.

not sure but i think traditional muzzleloaders don't have barrels rated for copper plated slugs. maybe assa knows whether that's true or not.

When did we start talking about traditional muzzleloaders?

so this thread is only for inlines?

It's for muzzleloaders in general I think. I would guess that doc is looking for a modern gun though.

just looked up the muzzleloader regs for MT, turns out you can't use anything other than roundball and it must have an exposed ignition device (flintlock, matchlock, wheelock, or percussion cap).

i assume modern inlines would fall into the regular rifle category and could still be used, but wouldn't be considered muzzleloaders by MT law. best to check your state regs.[/quote]

Ever heard of Jim Shockey? Pretty sure he has every record on a .45 and .50 muzzle loader including elephant...but i guess your tiny elk or moose wouldd be a tougher kill?

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

NuffDaddy wrote:

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

NuffDaddy wrote:

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:[quote="NuffDaddy"]Why use lead balls? We use copper plated hollow points with a wad. They destroy a deer... I can't see why they wouldn't take down an elk or moose.

not sure but i think traditional muzzleloaders don't have barrels rated for copper plated slugs. maybe assa knows whether that's true or not.

When did we start talking about traditional muzzleloaders?

so this thread is only for inlines?

It's for muzzleloaders in general I think. I would guess that doc is looking for a modern gun though.

just looked up the muzzleloader regs for MT, turns out you can't use anything other than roundball and it must have an exposed ignition device (flintlock, matchlock, wheelock, or percussion cap).

i assume modern inlines would fall into the regular rifle category and could still be used, but wouldn't be considered muzzleloaders by MT law. best to check your state regs.[/quote]
That's dumb.

NuffDaddy wrote:

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

NuffDaddy wrote:

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

NuffDaddy wrote:Why use lead balls? We use copper plated hollow points with a wad. They destroy a deer... I can't see why they wouldn't take down an elk or moose.

not sure but i think traditional muzzleloaders don't have barrels rated for copper plated slugs. maybe assa knows whether that's true or not.

When did we start talking about traditional muzzleloaders?

so this thread is only for inlines?

It's for muzzleloaders in general I think. I would guess that doc is looking for a modern gun though.

fo sho

ManlyMan wrote:

NuffDaddy wrote:

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

NuffDaddy wrote:

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:[quote="NuffDaddy"]Why use lead balls? We use copper plated hollow points with a wad. They destroy a deer... I can't see why they wouldn't take down an elk or moose.

not sure but i think traditional muzzleloaders don't have barrels rated for copper plated slugs. maybe assa knows whether that's true or not.

When did we start talking about traditional muzzleloaders?

so this thread is only for inlines?

It's for muzzleloaders in general I think. I would guess that doc is looking for a modern gun though.

fo sho[/quote]
I don't think you can really go wrong. Just don't get any off brand stuff and you'll get a good gun. I really recommend getting the break open kind with a hammer instead of an inline gun. My dads is the break open kind and it's about as simple as it gets. He can get his breach plug out with a pocket knife and the 209 cap goes on and off with your fingers. Mine is inline and it's kind of a PITA. I have to pull out a cap off the back with an Allen wrench, then take out the bolt and spring, then use a tool to get the breach plug out. Not real practical if you have an issue in the field. I also need a little tool to get the primer on and off. If I forget it or loose it I'm pretty much fucked.

cva wolf el-cheapo. .50cal .i shoot same load for all. .45 cal sabot 245 gr hollow point 150gr of 777 .open sites .9 deer 1 prong horn 2 doe elk and this one. i do my job and it drops em .only had one run and he went less than 100yds .my wife had a t/c black dimond sort like a bolt gun . a sob to clean and no way to unload easy .the wolf tip it open pull breach drop out powder and push sabot up some next hunt drop powder in breach end push load tight good to go

Eric Haynes wrote:Ever heard of Jim Shockey? Pretty sure he has every record on a .45 and .50 muzzle loader including elephant...but i guess your tiny elk or moose wouldd be a tougher kill?

heard his name and know he shoots some sort of blackpowder gun, but besides that i haven't ever heard much about him.

i'm sure you can kill an elk or moose with a .50, i would just want that little bit of extra oomph to make sure i don't stick a roundball in its rib, or in the case of moose to have it come charging through the brush. if you only have one shot, it seems you would want maximum knockdown power. also, elk hunting out here means that you may have to defend yourself if a grizzly shows up, not too sure a .50 would do well.

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

Eric Haynes wrote:Ever heard of Jim Shockey? Pretty sure he has every record on a .45 and .50 muzzle loader including elephant...but i guess your tiny elk or moose wouldd be a tougher kill?

heard his name and know he shoots some sort of blackpowder gun, but besides that i haven't ever heard much about him.

i'm sure you can kill an elk or moose with a .50, i would just want that little bit of extra oomph to make sure i don't stick a roundball in its rib, or in the case of moose to have it come charging through the brush. if you only have one shot, it seems you would want maximum knockdown power. also, elk hunting out here means that you may have to defend yourself if a grizzly shows up, not too sure a .50 would do well.

How many grizzlies have you seen while elk hunting?

Bulldog0156 wrote:

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

Eric Haynes wrote:Ever heard of Jim Shockey? Pretty sure he has every record on a .45 and .50 muzzle loader including elephant...but i guess your tiny elk or moose wouldd be a tougher kill?

heard his name and know he shoots some sort of blackpowder gun, but besides that i haven't ever heard much about him.

i'm sure you can kill an elk or moose with a .50, i would just want that little bit of extra oomph to make sure i don't stick a roundball in its rib, or in the case of moose to have it come charging through the brush. if you only have one shot, it seems you would want maximum knockdown power. also, elk hunting out here means that you may have to defend yourself if a grizzly shows up, not too sure a .50 would do well.

How many grizzlies have you seen while elk hunting?

dude come on. it was a hypothetical situation that can occur and has occurred recently. Remember the bowhunter that lost his face a few years back?

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

Bulldog0156 wrote:

(MT)Montanafowler wrote:

Eric Haynes wrote:Ever heard of Jim Shockey? Pretty sure he has every record on a .45 and .50 muzzle loader including elephant...but i guess your tiny elk or moose wouldd be a tougher kill?

heard his name and know he shoots some sort of blackpowder gun, but besides that i haven't ever heard much about him.

i'm sure you can kill an elk or moose with a .50, i would just want that little bit of extra oomph to make sure i don't stick a roundball in its rib, or in the case of moose to have it come charging through the brush. if you only have one shot, it seems you would want maximum knockdown power. also, elk hunting out here means that you may have to defend yourself if a grizzly shows up, not too sure a .50 would do well.

How many grizzlies have you seen while elk hunting?

dude come on. it was a hypothetical situation that can occur and has occurred recently. Remember the bowhunter that lost his face a few years back?

It was a dumb hypothetical at that. Do you know how big .50 even is? Have you seen what a ball will do to anything? Get whatever you want but don't sit here and tell me any animal in NA will take a .50 shot and laugh. That's just nonsense.

Eric Haynes wrote:It was a dumb hypothetical at that. Do you know how big .50 even is? Have you seen what a ball will do to anything? Get whatever you want but don't sit here and tell me any animal in NA will take a .50 shot and laugh. That's just nonsense.

glad to see you can read. All Hail to the Mighty Eric Haynes, Slayer of Animals Far and Wide and God of all Ballistics Knowledge.